Dr. Jill Garrett, the founder of Motherhood Feels, is a licensed psychologist with expertise and specialization in perinatal mental health. With over a decade of clinical experience and leadership in this field, Dr. Garrett is well-equipped to support all your Motherhood Feels.
Today, she shares her journey into motherhood, what brought her to create a Perinatal Day Program at the hospital wherein she works, and how she fills her cup as a working mom.
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Q: Who are you before labels, titles, or what someone could Google about you?
A: That's such a tough question, because I think, if I was googled, you would find some of the things like a psychologist and a person who likes to do amateur triathlons. Maybe you would see that I'm a mom, but maybe not. I think what you wouldn't find is that I'm a person who really just likes people, and I am a person who is curious and interested in being able to connect and get my energy from people.
Q: Have you always done triathlons?
A: Well, let me preface this by saying the things I do now are really different from what I have done in the past. So, in the past, I have done a marathon and I've done longer triathlons. In this season of life, I have focused on doing 5ks and sprint triathlons, because I don't have a lot of time. So, that being said, in addition to being curious and interested in people, I would also consider myself to be a pretty goal-oriented person who likes to set something to work toward. So, it's always nice to have a little something that I'm working toward. It might be one of these short sprint triathlons or it might be a little neighborhood 5k. So, that's always been fun for me.
Q: There's something really personal about taking that time for yourself and setting those goals for yourself that have nothing to do with work or parenting. Talk to us about that.
A: Well, I will say that if you continue to do any sort of competition as you age, you also become a quote-unquote winner. So, as I've aged up and fewer people do things, I end up placing in some of the categories, which is just an added bonus of being an old person, basically. But, I think that I really do like to practice what I preach in terms of self-care. So, if you know me, you know that I take lots of walks around my neighborhood, listen to podcasts, talk on the phone and, while I go out and do things with my kids too, it is really important for me to be able to just do my own thing and get out and move around a little bit.
Q: What was your entrance to motherhood like?
A: It's actually interesting that you bring up that piece about the challenges with being able to take care of yourself as a mom, because that probably was my entrance into this specialty of maternal mental health.
So, I had my first daughter who is now almost ten. I had an unexpected C-section, and what I didn't really anticipate was the fact that I knew I was going to have either a surgery or some sort of delivery that I would have to recover from, but I didn't really think about what that meant. So, for some reason, it didn't really hit me that I would need to probably not move my body for six weeks or so. I remember in those early days after having my oldest daughter, being like, “That's a big outlet for me, and I'm not feeling as great because I can't do those things.”
I would say to my OB, “Are you sure I can't just take a swim? Or, what could I do? What can I kind of do?” Her suggestion was to sit in the car and take a drive. Those were nice ideas, but it was really that I wanted to be able to move and go out and do more.
So, that's when I noticed that moods can shift when you have shifts in your day-to-day, particularly when you have a baby. So, ultimately, I have really devoted this last ten years of my career to maternal mental health.
Q: Prior to that shift of really focusing on maternal mental health, were you practicing as a general psychologist? Who were you seeing?
A: So, before this specialty, I had worked in a lot of different spaces. I had worked at the VA, so working with veterans. I had worked in a hospital system, working with folks who had endured traumatic brain injuries, spinal cord injuries, other physical or life-threatening challenges where you're in an intensive care unit. I had worked in schools and residential treatment centers. I had so many different cool experiences, and I liked all of them. Then, when I became a mom myself, it really became even more interesting to delve into this field.
Q: When you were first experiencing those mood shifts with your first, was there something that hit you or some light bulb moment that you had where you were like, “Wait, this helped me or this didn't help me. Or, I wish I had known xyz.” that catalyzed that shift into supporting other moms? Or, what did that shift look like? Was it a quick pivot, or did it take a minute to find that type of patient?
A: So, if I'm looking back at my experience in this field, I wouldn't put one time stamp on a time when I would say, “Oh, I've got this light bulb moment.” But, I would say that over the course of learning about this specialty, I really learned a lot about myself. That's been an added bonus of learning about this. So, it has helped my insight. The more I'm helping other people, it also tends to help selfishly. It helps to develop and gain more perspective. The thing that I really valued was being able to just learn about this whole topic, and I really did this deep dive on all things perinatal mood and anxiety disorders when I noticed that I was feeling a little bit more anxious in this period of time.
Q: Why do you think our culture doesn't prepare the mother?
A: That's a great question, and part of what I have devoted a big part of one of my support platforms to. So, I created this course called Before Baby Boot Camp, where people can log on, take these short video vignettes, grab a handbook, and learn about these potential changes and strategies to cope.
Because, remember how I said I knew I was going to have a baby, but I didn't even consider, “Oh, you're not going to be able to move around.”? That sounds odd to not even put that together, but I wasn't planning on how I was going to take care of myself. I was doing all the things. I had a baby registry. I had all the diapers. I had parties. That was fun and good, but with hindsight, I wish that I had more education and information and strategies for healthy coping. So, that's a big piece of what I put together on Motherhood Feels, the Before Baby Boot Camp.
Q: When you're talking to moms, how are you having those conversations with potentially first-time moms?
A: One of the things that I run into is that people don't know they need it until they need it. If this became more normalized and things like the Before Baby Boot Camp and other support options that were proactive became part of the checklist of becoming a parent—and I say parent because it's moms and dads—I think it would really behoove our society and culture to have that.
So, one platform I've created is all about proactive coping. I have little rhyming story books with mental health messages that are designed to one, be able to normalize, like, “Hey, here's your baby shower gift. Here's this little rhyming story book.” But, it also gives you information, education, and strategies. So, it just becomes part of the conversation. I'm hopeful that it can be something that could be part of hospital discharge paperwork, or your OB gives it to you so it's part of the conversation.
Q:How do you define baby blues clinically, and what can women think about proactively?
A: So, baby blues is a term that people might have heard of and, a lot of times, people confuse it with depression. It's not that. Actually, it's just typical adjustment to having a baby. It tends to peak at about three to five days postpartum, and it really doesn't last longer than two to three weeks. The reason it happens is you're having this big hormone dump. Not to mention, you're not sleeping. Your body is recovering from having a baby and you are now in charge of a baby. So, it makes a lot of sense to have some emotions that feel a little bit more out of whack—feeling more tearful, more on edge, having sleeping challenges. So, baby blues are that period of time those first few weeks. About 85 percent of moms will experience baby blues. It's not a disorder, it's just typical adjustment.
Q: Talk to us about when, how, where postpartum anxiety shows up and depression.
A: So, you've got the baby blues, which is this typical change with emotions that occurs the first couple of weeks for most people. However, if you have ongoing challenges with things like anxiety or mood being low or, really, any emotional health challenge after that marker, then we're kind of in what is called the territory of perinatal mood and anxiety disorders. So, there is really no time frame when we say, “Well, it's definitely going to develop this week or this month.” But, any time in that postpartum period, which is usually defined as about one year or so after having had a baby. So, if you're having any emotional health challenge—it might be panic attacks, it might be scary thoughts, it might be nightmares or flashbacks of a trauma—if you're having any symptoms like that during that time, it's called a perinatal mood and anxiety disorder.
Q: Is it healthy to try to push through, or is it better to seek help?
A: So, you've got folks who might come into parenthood with some already identifiable risk factors, right? They've experienced emotional health challenges before, so they know they're a little bit more susceptible to experiencing emotional health challenges when they're pregnant or postpartum. So, I think it's really wise for people to have a proactive plan on how they're going to manage their health.
There are a lot of risk factors. My website has a whole risk factor checklist and, on it, you will see that, in addition to having a personal or family history of emotional health challenges, being a person who is more type A perfectionist, you are more susceptible to dealing with anxiety symptoms.
I think people do think, “Oh, I am strong. I can do this on my own.” But, I think the healthier option is to recognize that when you notice that things are tough, your insight is your strength and using your insight to pull for support is what you want to do.
Q: Do you recommend people go to their husband, go online, call a friend? What are some of the better conversations that you suggest your patients have with their partners or their family?
A: So, for one, in the boot camp, I have a way to create a personalized coping plan ahead of having a baby. It involves things like having a list of people to reach out to, or focusing on xyz.
But, I will also say in the work I do with patients, I hear people have questions about how to communicate how they're doing or how they are not doing well to their partners and support people. So, I think a really good way of doing that is to have a conversation ahead of having a baby.
It's helpful to look at some of these resources and say, “Hey, check this out. Did you know that as many as one in five and, sometimes, as many as one in three in certain populations of moms are going to experience emotional changes during pregnancy and postpartum?” And, guess what? Dads, one in ten of you will experience these challenges. So, let's be prepared and have a plan on how we can check in with each other and how we can make sure we're supporting each other.
Q: Tell us about the organization you created within the hospital.
A: So, I am employed at a hospital system here in Florida. After I had my daughter,I recognized that the department within where I work did not have any maternal mental health support. So, another mom and psychologist colleague of mine and I created a maternal mental health department—or, kind of service line.
In the last couple of years, I created a perinatal-specific program called the Motherhood Space for the hospital. It is three tiers. The first tier is going out and giving training to people who interact with moms who are pregnant. Give them some of these statistics and some of this information, and also give them resources.
I created a YouTube channel for moms as well at the Motherhood Space. We know moms are busy. They have different barriers. So, how about having a free online, easy-to-access information hub.
Then, the real piece that we've been excited about is the day program for moms who are pregnant and postpartum. We have free childcare and transportation for moms who could use help with transportation. It's wellness-focused. So, people who participate get a pass to the gym where we do the group therapy. We do walking therapy. We do yoga. We have a massage chair, private lactation space, and really cool, fun, evidence-based treatment for working with pregnant postpartum.
Part of what we do—and what we hear from the patients that we work with—is letting people know that there is a place where you can get support in a safe place with people who are trained in the specialty. The really neat part of my job is to hear moms come in and say, “Here I was suffering at home and I thought I was the only one.” Then, they come to this group therapy situation and they're like, “Oh my goodness, I am definitely not alone.” Then, we see people get better. So. it's super rewarding.
Q: Are you seeing moms come in post six months because they're finally coming up for air? Or, are you seeing more moms coming in six months or earlier?
A: So, our program is for moms who are up to 18 months postpartum. So, people are coming in at all sorts of time points. There are different barriers to coming to work with us, like having to have a job and not having a paycheck if you end up coming to our program and you need to be working. But, we see people who are several weeks postpartum and we see people who are 18 months postpartum.
Q: I would love for you to speak about how untreated PMADs lead to financial consequences for both employees and employers.
A: You're speaking to the portion of my organization Motherhood Feels that is working to embed with health care systems and corporations to offer support, because the vast majority of people in the workforce are parents. We've recently had the Surgeon General come out and say that parenting is a bit hazardous to one's health and that parents are struggling. So, part of my mission is being able to let people be able to take care of themselves, but let corporations also give support to their employees. It's a win-win. When you have an employee who is doing well, they are going to show up. They're going to be productive. Then, the corporation gets to say, “Okay, we've got healthy people who are well.” So, everybody wins.
The other piece I like to let people in on is that it's not just a mom issue. If a mom is suffering, she and her baby are suffering. She and her partner are suffering. She might not be able to go to school or work, and then the community suffers. It becomes this big snowball issue. So, let's be proactive and offer them support, and people will be a whole lot better off when we're able to take care of each other.
Q: Did you always want to become a mom? Being a mom who's aware of these issues, how are you balancing work and motherhood?
A: So, the short answer to “Did you always want to be a mom?” is yes. How am I balancing work and life? That's a great question. I wouldn't say I'm doing it at any expert level. I think there are days where I certainly feel like I'm not good enough at either of them because of the time demands that we all have. But, I'm fortunate in that I like my work a lot, so it doesn't actually feel like work. I am fortunate that when I'm with my kids and when they are in good spirits—because they're not always in the best spirits—we have a good time. So, I really have to just be pleased with the fact that I have these two awesome kids and also a job that I really love.
Q: What are some of the conversations around why you work in your family?
A: It's very challenging to say, “Don't have mom guilt.” I have mom guilt when my kids say, “Aren't you going to come and have lunch with me today? All the moms do it.” First of all, not accurate because I know not all the moms are doing it. But, it just makes it more important to be able to reframe some of that stuff from time-to-time where I say, “Listen, I do get to come and have lunch with you on this day and I am excited to do xyz thing with you on these points in time. But, I am going to be working during this time.” It's just very clearly defined that I have a job, but it's also clearly defined that I love them.
Q: What is your vision for the future? When you think about the maternal mental health space or just your work in general?
A: I am really eager to connect with healthcare and corporations to make this part of the day-to-day and to normalize that support is important. But, I'm also doing some other fun, interesting things. I'm working on a short film on dads. I'm also considering working on some short documentary type films on patients with whom I've worked. So, that is something that's on the horizon. So, if anybody who's listening is an expert at any of those things, feel free to reach out to me. I could use your support.
Q: Do you find it hard to shift gears between that creative side versus more of the business side?
A: Well, let's first put it out there that I very much enjoy the connectivity with people more than any sort of numbers and business. I have two different pathways in my work, one within a hospital system that has more rigidity and rules and requirements, and then also my own platform, Motherhood Feels, where I can have more flexibility, creative control, and autonomy. So, that's been a really nice piece of having these two different pathways with my career.
Q: Any good motherhood advice that you have received from somebody?
A: Make sure you're taking time for yourself. I think when it was early days of motherhood for me, I was so excited to be in the mix. I was probably worried to let go of some control and I didn't do as much to take care of myself. Ten years later, I am the first person to sign up for a spa day. But, see if you can remember that. If you have any guilt about taking time for yourself, come back to the idea that your kids are watching. So, if kids see you take a walk when you get frustrated or go hang out with friends, they're actually learning some healthy things. “Oh, wait a minute. It's okay to be upset and take a walk. Oh, it's okay to have your own friend group.”
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This blog post was written based on kozēkozē Podcast Episode 384: Motherhood Feels with Dr. Jill Garrett.
If you’d like to listen to the conversation first-hand, tune in here.